brera 2.4 jtdm unusual sound from the turbine [file included]

[david]

sorry you have changed the system with a valve blow off pop off)
if that is original and we do not have it.. and we didn't even have the wastgate... for that what do I know...
we have the variable geometry... and the excess pressure is discharged from the egr...
I assume that the egr is excluded from the map.. you have mounted a flange fully closed?
regarding the behavior of the turbo.. before you change the solenoid valve... pieburg.. or as you call.. and then see how it behaves... works on geometry.. and you have problems right on that.. then again.. email the map.. maybe you have a problem with the management of an overboost...

[sighline]

What a mess... I have done research on ****** about the wastegate on the 2.4 jtdm and I was not able to understand whether or not there is
When I accelerate in first getting the prex to 1.5 and then instantly remove your foot from the gas, I feel the effect of the blow off valve ( I) the typical tiutiu that you hear on the turbo petrol .. Before I had a alfa gt 1.9 and did the same thing ..

Anyway, the egr is plugged with a non-perforated plate and excluded from the ecu

[david]

now I understand..
it's a noise kind of "absorption" is also my... and normal... with the flange and is more accentuated with the dpf.. it was non-existent this noise..
replace the pieburg... and see if it disappears this whistle dancer to a minimum.. and this strange behavior of the hand..
it is a solenoid valve, pneumatic (more or less.. the correct term I)
by exploiting the depression to move the polmoncino close to the turbine.. and adjusts the variable geometry...
my full throttle.. salt to 1.6 (hypothetical), then down to 1.4 fixed..
while in meta, gas.. as you say... salt type.. to 1.2 and then stabilize to 0.8 with less pressure on the pedal to 0.4...
then... the defect.. turbo.. it just makes the map "spider" or even with the ori?..
if they do not, with the ori... and a problem of the map.. however I am dell idea.. that the pieburg is to change.. and in addition to the whistle dancer.. you bust the operation of the geometry..

[rts]

Hello, since doing the tests look at the values of a solenoid valve of the variable geometry Pierburg
Power supply: 12 volt on the way 2 of the connector.
Resistance on the terminals of the solenoid valve): 16 Ω, and obviously, as a gi? said tubes

[tidus1985]

it takes a diagnosis of a stroke, maximum pressure? some remanufactured make these whistles and I have seen them go up to the machine ? way to collapse....
diagnosis with fiat ecu scan if possible with values of turbo pressure measured and request, % valve geometry, rotational speed and quantity of fuel required, so let's see if cmq works well, however it seems the classic sound of the tree that is cavitation on the bushings in the dive in oil, but hopefully not so otherwise ?would already oil

[rts]

The turbine supports that ? new and non-current, even to me ? stumbled upon a great point that fischiettano but without problems.... let's see if we update

[siggey]

The modern turbo diesel turbines have variable geometry, and do not have the waste gate, followed by a brief explanation.

Variable geometry turbocharger

Conceptually identical to the turbocharger, the difference pi? great from this ? inherent in the impeller to the engine exhaust. In fact, it ? surrounded by vanes in which the movement, controlled by the electronic controller determines the variation of the angle of incidence of the exhaust gas with the vanes of the impeller for driving the same. In function of the rotation speed, these are open or closed to facilitate the speed? or, the flow to the second of the schemes themselves. There? leads to greater flexibility? and adaptability? with respect to the "Turbo" a nut fixed: a variable turbine geometry allows to obtain the same low inertia of a turbine of small size and the flow rate of air (and therefore power) of a turbine of a larger size. The field of application of the pi? the vast ? one of the Diesel high-pressure injection such as Common Rail and the injector pump.


Wastegate

In the turbocharged internal combustion engine, the wastegate ? a valve of maximum pressure used for the control of the operating conditions of the turbine driven by exhaust gas.

Use
In the case where the accelerator was always held down, the speed? of the turbine would increase leading, consequently, to an increase of the turbocharging pressure that, above a certain ****lli, and could jeopardize the integrity? some of the components of the engine. To check the continuation of this vicious circle is precisely used a valve, called the wastegate, that opens above a certain pressure allowing a part of exhaust gas to bypass the turbine and flow towards the outside. This implies a decrease of the speed? of rotation of the impeller and, consequently, a reduction of the turbocharger. There is also a blockage of this valve. In the strong acceleration you will enter the"an overboost". This function blocks the wastegate for a few seconds so that the engine can have all the air pumped by the turbine. In the past this was regulated by a timer now ? regulated by an electronic control unit (or ECU).

Operation
The action of this valve, positioned in the exhaust manifold (on the side of the turbine), ? proportional to the boost pressure (the compressor side) is open.

The action of the wastegate is to prevent the charging system from being stressed excessively, while maintaining the speed? rotation of the turbine within certain limits, by limiting the boost pressure maximum.

In the case of wastegate pneumatic tube applied on the compressor side actuates the wastegate valve. Exceeded the limit of danger, and the internal pressure from the compressor side overcomes the resistance of the valve spring and causes the opening. In this way, part of the exhaust gas is ducted to the outside, bypassing the turbine, which decelerates along with the compressor, thereby avoiding an excessive boost pressure. There? is because both the turbine and the compressor are placed on the same shaft; the rotation speed of both ? then identical. By decreasing the amount? of the exhaust gas which strikes the turbine reduces the wind speed? rotation of the turbine and of the compressor, and therefore the supply pressure.

In cars, the new concept of the wastegate ? instead controlled electrically by the ECU.

[rts]

The modern turbo diesel turbines have variable geometry, and do not have the waste gate, followed by a brief explanation.

Variable geometry turbocharger

Conceptually identical to the turbocharger, the difference pi? great from this ? inherent in the impeller to the engine exhaust. In fact, it ? surrounded by vanes in which the movement, controlled by the electronic controller determines the variation of the angle of incidence of the exhaust gas with the vanes of the impeller for driving the same. In function of the rotation speed, these are open or closed to facilitate the speed? or, the flow to the second of the schemes themselves. There? leads to greater flexibility? and adaptability? with respect to the "Turbo" a nut fixed: a variable turbine geometry allows to obtain the same low inertia of a turbine of small size and the flow rate of air (and therefore power) of a turbine of a larger size. The field of application of the pi? the vast ? one of the Diesel high-pressure injection such as Common Rail and the injector pump.


Wastegate

In the turbocharged internal combustion engine, the wastegate ? a valve of maximum pressure used for the control of the operating conditions of the turbine driven by exhaust gas.

Use
In the case where the accelerator was always held down, the speed? of the turbine would increase leading, consequently, to an increase of the turbocharging pressure that, above a certain ****lli, and could jeopardize the integrity? some of the components of the engine. To check the continuation of this vicious circle is precisely used a valve, called the wastegate, that opens above a certain pressure allowing a part of exhaust gas to bypass the turbine and flow towards the outside. This implies a decrease of the speed? of rotation of the impeller and, consequently, a reduction of the turbocharger. There is also a blockage of this valve. In the strong acceleration you will enter the"an overboost". This function blocks the wastegate for a few seconds so that the engine can have all the air pumped by the turbine. In the past this was regulated by a timer now ? regulated by an electronic control unit (or ECU).

Operation
The action of this valve, positioned in the exhaust manifold (on the side of the turbine), ? proportional to the boost pressure (the compressor side) is open.

The action of the wastegate is to prevent the charging system from being stressed excessively, while maintaining the speed? rotation of the turbine within certain limits, by limiting the boost pressure maximum.

In the case of wastegate pneumatic tube applied on the compressor side actuates the wastegate valve. Exceeded the limit of danger, and the internal pressure from the compressor side overcomes the resistance of the valve spring and causes the opening. In this way, part of the exhaust gas is ducted to the outside, bypassing the turbine, which decelerates along with the compressor, thereby avoiding an excessive boost pressure. There? is because both the turbine and the compressor are placed on the same shaft; the rotation speed of both ? then identical. By decreasing the amount? of the exhaust gas which strikes the turbine reduces the wind speed? rotation of the turbine and of the compressor, and therefore the supply pressure.

In cars, the new concept of the wastegate ? instead controlled electrically by the ECU.

..***** and school Excellent explanation...but the man of the whistle where ? finished???

[siggey]

Sar? whistled via......

[sighline]

Here I am .. sorry for the delay in reply ..
The whistle after 4 months that I have it and no one here in the area was not able to fix it I came to understand the provinienza of the latter..
It comes from the exhaust manifold .. that is the gasket between the manifold and the turbo, or the captives of the broken or cracked that connect the manifold to the cylinder head .. if not sbalgio there are 10 , 2 for each cylinder ( 1 above and 1 below).

Can't it be the other by following the simple logic : in full accelerazzione the pressure rises to 1.5 in the range 1400-4300 rpm is still there ..
But the air flow rate (pressure) request after 3 thousand rpm and more than 1.5 bar . glue the map that there is expected to grow to 1.7 -1.8 .. Instead of all this mass of air that is released from the valves to the turbine is dispersed without get there.. obviously not making it turn more .. qnd always remains at 1.5 bar .. Saw that in this regime the geometry opens up the entire flow of the air ignited goes directly to influence the impeller .. ( seen that at low rpm the pressure is obtained thanks to the geometry almost closed)
And then the fact that in the full pull with the presence of the whistle I can smell the fuel in the passenger compartment
Then : this smoke is the result of the false air , that is, one that comes from the valves of the motor is NOT coming to the turbine.. And it is precisely here that blows..
Problem in theory is solved by myself hehe

Also xke can't it be the other !
If it were a sleeve broken not saliva never to 1.5 bar..and then, over time, you would be completely broken ( if the hole or crack was small)
Here, however, the whistle will never change .. even if the past 10 thousand km!

For when about sound dancer to a minimum and the pierburg - Can anyone tell me if it is normal for the air from the decompressor to come out ? 'Cause when we breath in to the tube that goes to the decompressor feel the air coming out somewhere.. while if I aspire to be them' nothing happens!! I will create a vacuum in the mouth ! In comparison , the tubing out from the converter pressure ( pierburg) what not it goes to the turbine , but round that goes inside the intake manifold x then end up in the decompressor...

Thanks to all of you !