View The Full Version : belt failure distribution alfa 156 jtm16v 140cv
hi!I ? arrived in the workshop a alfa 156 mtj16v that broke the timing belt,after having dismantled the valve cover I noticed that 15 out of the 16 rocker arms were broken.I get the rocker arms,arrivatomi I minister to the assembly.after reassembling everything the car starts perfectly,smooth idle,performance identity before the break,only thing ? exit out ? a beat of puntaria that you feel that only on one cylinder*****and do you check which or which the tappet ? gone?
ps I also replaced the oil and oil filter before starting the machine after cleaning.
I hope I don't change them all, and 16 for one rumoraccio.
cinqueturbo
09-02-2014, 20:03
X control which or which the tappet ? went just to see the one and molleggia..
the pane to the need or not to replace all the 16 it seems to me you sell even 8x time I would not like to be wrong..
legendaryslave
09-02-2014, 20:46
Also replaced the hydraulic lifters, all
IlCurioso
09-02-2014, 21:08
The punetrie idrailiche before re-installation does not need to download them from the oil? Cos? you can see if there? some of them stuck...
Also replaced the hydraulic lifters, all
the exact procedure in these cases, and the replacement of all the lifters, because they have suffered a crushing affect the operation, as to be changed all the rocker arms, even those that do not are broken.
blackwolf76
09-02-2014, 21:36
The beat may also be caused by a valve, bent... no ? said that in addition to the noise should give you other symptoms, type of smoke or loss of performance, having those valves with the stem very up and even though bent manage to close anyway in their homes.
if it is bent, I do not believe that close, and if you are not close enough to measure the compression that you can see it immediately.
Considering what has been said until now, the causes of the noise if you're sure both of the tappet, everything changes, and controls the range
mechanical 85
09-02-2014, 21:49
I agree with hugo boss. To me, and understood, and x to go on the safe side I changed all 16 lifters full of hammers, x valves are difficult to bend, another thing you have to check if you have loosened the two bolts of the axis to games hello to soon
cinqueturbo
09-02-2014, 22:00
I agree with hugo boss. To me, and understood, and x to go on the safe side I changed all 16 lifters full of hammers, x valves are difficult to bend, another thing you have to check if you have loosened the two bolts of the axis to games hello to soon
Hello mechanic 85,do you remember s? sold them 8 at a time, or all 16,
just to interested to remind myself..
it seems to me that they do packs of 4.
mechanical 85
10-02-2014, 00:15
8 at the time, but I advise you to change all of 16
thanks to all for the suggestions.regardless of all the other things are ok,valves,screws, camm etc...the thing that I wanted to say, seeing that the customer has the intention to give away the car, and he said, spends less better ? I wanted to know the way how you control the integrity of the tappet so as to replace only the one or ones damaged.my part to sell them individually, and also on ebay.
mechanical 85
10-02-2014, 00:18
I bought from the mecc diesel are great
8 at the time, but I advise you to change all of 16
your board of directors ? absolutely right!but having regard to the cost of all the 16 and saw that the pulse is only a cylinder, I believe, that if c? the way to intercept the damaged ones do you not believe that ? it is best to change those that do not work since the client needs to give away?.I explain how do I see the ones that are not good?thanks.
mechanical 85
10-02-2014, 12:45
your board of directors ? absolutely right!but having regard to the cost of all the 16 and saw that the pulse is only a cylinder, I believe, that if c? the way to intercept the damaged ones do you not believe that ? it is best to change those that do not work since the client needs to give away?.I explain how do I see the ones that are not good?thanks.
The only thing that you can do and try to remove the tappets and try to change the springs. Usually you always break The hammers above the tappets and then change only those broken controls well
marcogti
10-02-2014, 12:50
You may otherwise opt for an oil pi? dense so that the tappet does not download. Obvious that to replace them all as you have recommended ? the best thing to do.
if they drive the ball valves must cambiarle.sono thinner than a cigarette I could lasciarle.se yield after the motor, you can cestinarlo
if they drive the ball valves must cambiarle.sono thinner than a cigarette I could lasciarle.se yield after the motor, you can cestinarlo
ops, I wanted to write if they had the ball.
if they drive the ball valves must cambiarle.sono thinner than a cigarette I could lasciarle.se yield after the motor, you can cestinarlo
ops, I wanted to write if they had the ball.
these engines are mounted two valve types a type is more subtle (which are those that you say), the others are more' big,I don't see why they should give in,the rockers are made specifically to take the barrel, and then go into the break without that the valves are damaged,if they had had some damage from the compression test would not be all the same and then after the cold start I believe that the engine would not turn well but not ? success,the engine has just this little beat that ? only on one cylinder I think it is one or two at the max of the tappet.
these engines are mounted two valve types a type is more subtle (which are those that you say), the others are more' big,I don't see why they should give in,the rockers are made specifically to take the barrel, and then go into the break without that the valves are damaged,if they had had some damage from the compression test would not be all the same and then after the cold start I believe that the engine would not turn well but not ? success,the engine has just this little beat that ? only on one cylinder I think it is one or two at the max of the tappet.
ops I forgot to say that those mounted du this engine are the most large.
Yes, but there's a you ? Damaged, and better after changing the engine? A colleague happened I figured on the 8 valves.changes? only the caps of the valves result? On the highway after about 6000 km has destroyed the engine.valve head split open.prevention is better than cure
Yes, but there's a you ? Damaged, and better after changing the engine? A colleague happened I figured on the 8 valves.changes? only the caps of the valves result? On the highway after about 6000 km has destroyed the engine.valve head split open.prevention is better than cure
the 8 valves do not have the rocker arms shaped to break, we talk about two different engines.
In fact, if you read I said the caps are not rockers. L example l I did cn l 8 valve that has a valve very large.
In fact, if you read I said the caps are not rockers. L example l I did cn l 8 valve that has a valve very large.
in any case you can not make comparisons, and is designed to not bend the valves, the other is not, then on the 8 valves will always be damage to the valves, without distinction, that damage caps or not.
Precisely the damage you create more? on 16 on 8.he's also the face.goes well anyway I sostituerei to stay more? quiet
in any case you can not make comparisons, and is designed to not bend the valves, the other is not, then on the 8 valves will always be damage to the valves, without distinction, that damage caps or not.
in any case you can not make comparisons, and is designed to not bend the valves, the other is not, then on the 8 valves will always be damage to the valves, without distinction, that damage caps or not.
are d accordissimo,in fact, is called the system saves the valves,where the bilencieri absorb l impact antando break,while, on the contrary not ? so on the dell system 8 valves.even if the valve is ? small l shock which is given by the piston is transferred to the rocker arm which, in turn, before the breaking of the transfer(depending on the location in which it is located) on the puntaria and camshaft.
I in my experience, maybe you will? was luck on the 16v engines I have had to replace only the hammers only ones broken....then the cylinders for them to drain , replace oil and filter, everything is ok. ...never any problems. ..obviously a bit of experience it takes a long time ago a customer of mine with a quaver without breaking the belt and I had to change a wheel cylinder why? not loading....it was an exaggerated noise.
I in my experience, maybe you will? was luck on the 16v engines I have had to replace only the hammers only ones broken....then the cylinders for them to drain , replace oil and filter, everything is ok. ...never any problems. ..obviously a bit of experience it takes a long time ago a customer of mine with a quaver without breaking the belt and I had to change a wheel cylinder why? not loading....it was an exaggerated noise.
I confirm I have lived I the same experience replaced the hammers and via
I confirm, and I experience always replaced all the lifters, where there was a broken rocker arm
bytebyte
16-02-2014, 10:03
also to me ? happened, I substitute everything, rocker arms and tappets so as to be safe, as for the 1.3 mjet
also to me ? happened, I substitute everything, rocker arms and tappets so as to be safe, as for the 1.3 mjet
well!easy,so even if you change the engine, I do not think that the face the most?' noise,I believe that if one understands when a component ? good,a little damaged, or not working right is the best thing in figuring out whether to do the replacement because that leaves more pleased with the customer.in my case I had 15 rocker arms broken,I have changed 16 saw that they were a different brand than the original I have not changed puntarie but I think that the damaged ones are only in one cylinder, feeling the beat.
if I knew how controlled I was going to intercept the damaged ones, them the replacement and I had no issues with noise even though the batttito not ? fortissimo.
this is because the client does not have the possibility of economic and you are talking of€ 160 in the most seen what they cost, and also because he wants to change the car.
thanks to you now I've learned to control them and I don't think I'll have this type of problem.
I will say that, from experience, you should always replace, why? I am also able to check if they have suffered damage or not? me and happened that in the beginning worked to perfection while then after a short time someone turns out to be defective, and here's the bad figure is made with the customer
autronica
16-02-2014, 17:36
the short hydraulic is also individually, you can buy one. for? as suggested it is best to replace them all since the blow!...by spinning the motor by hand, put the cams of the axes in the position of the valve closed alternately for each piston, when the rocker arm is discharge, press with a screwdriver or a finger to the sky of the tappet, if it yields only a millimeter also pushing strong then the follower to be changed.
a glass is broken you can see it now....
if once you have downloaded an oil "molleggia" by smashing it manually ? to change....
a glass is broken you can see it now....
if once you have downloaded an oil "molleggia" by smashing it manually ? to change....
The said experience from the times for a first period works well then it breaks........the figure of......... ? guaranteed
ok, thanks guys!I ordered 16 puntarie,the customer decided to keep the macchina.grazie to all for your help,always available.
beppe unfortunately he is right by us in sicily people ? still in the stone age just ke save would need to mount well as the m... cmq I personally jtdm cn the head removed I've had 4 ke have bent the valves, and on one I had to replace the connecting rod 2 is bent the most? 1 cames broken and head injured I leave you a while to imagine, then I don't know if it will always work the system saves the valves
blackwolf76
27-02-2014, 23:49
That system, in my opinion, does not save anything for sure.
If a valve gets a shot could always break, bend, and maybe close 90% pure that you'll see nothing if not that you have compression problems.
So much for statistics me ? had a 159 that broken swirl bent 14 and I say 14 valves. Also on an opel that has the same system I have ? happened to bend the valves after that ? was badly the distribution and the guy did turn the motor by hand...
A 1.3 mj that broke the chain after it is reassembled by replacing only the hammers has not walked more? well, if not after rismontato everything and replaced the valves.
From personal experience when it goes out-of-phase motor to restore to full efficiency, and avoid making figures petty with the customer, always touches disassemble and check the valves.
That system, in my opinion, does not save anything for sure.
If a valve gets a shot could always break, bend, and maybe close 90% pure that you'll see nothing if not that you have compression problems.
So much for statistics me ? had a 159 that broken swirl bent 14 and I say 14 valves. Also on an opel that has the same system I have ? happened to bend the valves after that ? was badly the distribution and the guy did turn the motor by hand...
A 1.3 mj that broke the chain after it is reassembled by replacing only the hammers has not walked more? well, if not after rismontato everything and replaced the valves.
From personal experience when it goes out-of-phase motor to restore to full efficiency, and avoid making figures petty with the customer, always touches disassemble and check the valves.
I'm sorry but I agree with you,if a valve closes to 90% the engine idling goes to 3 if ? a 4 cylinder,if you close to 99% cold would be the least shaky and the engine would not have excellent performance,the system saves the valves, I can tell you that most of the times you broke only the hammers (for all the times that me ? happened).
anyway, Monday I bring the car and provide you with the replacement tappets.
I am agree with blackwolf xk? on my skin I found the cars cn valves bent some nn ? always but it happens ke valves from bending enough to ke a hammer broken you put d traverso creates thickness and then in an engine happens all over d
the beat in addition to the tappets can also come from the phase does not specify,you have checked that the two shafts are in phase?
the beat in addition to the tappet can also come from the stage are not precise,you have checked that the two shafts are in phase?forgive me!!but I know distimguere
the pulse from a phase does not specify that ? different from the beat of one or more tappets.
If you check the compression, not the first?
today I replaced all the puntarie,the ticking and almost went away completely but the strange thing was that it was only the climb up to 2300 rpm, the thing seemed to me very strange,when I came into the workshop-I have the mil lights up with error injector n3 was that the pin that after sitemata ? disappeared also what was left of the ticking.
And now they still do? Or to the fixed
today I replaced all the puntarie,the ticking and almost went away completely but the strange thing was that it was only the climb up to 2300 rpm, the thing seemed to me very strange,when I came into the workshop-I have the mil lights up with error injector n3 was that the pin that after sitemata ? disappeared also what was left of the ticking.
very likely that at that point it was the injector that is not working good beating.
mechanical 85
29-03-2014, 00:23
Sar? state a case why? if it was the plug on the machine go to 3 cylinders and lit the lamp injection
very likely that at that point it was the injector that is not working good beating.
I think they're both after the replacement of the tappet is still beating, but much less after the organization of the spinetta not the most in fact.
mechanical 85
29-03-2014, 20:31
But most likely it will be attached to bad the plug after the replacement of the tappet
cinqueturbo
30-03-2014, 00:18
The tappets new still require a bit of time to load..
dariuccio
30-03-2014, 12:41
you a few seconds
But most likely it will be attached to bad the plug after the replacement of the tappet
the pin was not attached to evil,but it was one of the two wires that was not making contact well I replaced the two pins,you are obviously not making contact well did not work well l injector,maybe ? ruined after the two disconnections for the replacement of the tappet.
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